“There have been two big failures on Putin's side in this war”

• 8.07.2025, 14:14

Swedish MEP Urges not to make concessions to the Kremlin leader.

Sweden became a NATO member in 2024, becoming the 32nd country to join the Alliance. Why did Stockholm abandon its neutrality? Is there a threat from Russia to this Scandinavian country? Should Belarus become a NATO member?

The website Charter97.org discussed these questions with Swedish MEP Tomas Tobé.

— According to SVT broadcaster, Russia is significantly upgrading its nuclear weapon facilities in the proximity of Sweden. Should there be any concerns in that regard?

— Russia is a terrorist state. They are attempting to create a threat to Europe through these activities. We need to be strong in our resistance to Russia through NATO, in our support to Ukraine. As a Swede, I must say that we have a very long relationship with the Baltic states. I am glad that through NATO membership, we have the opportunity to have Swedes as part of the troops in Latvia, for example. We have the common strengths of NATO to react to these kinds of activities.

— So, you do consider that the membership for Sweden in NATO is important?

— It is a very strong pillar because we have the strategy of mutual defense guarantees. NATO membership is extremely important for Sweden, as we get a strong defense. We also have a lot to offer NATO and for the Nordic Baltic region. The mutual defense guarantees for Sweden is something that I'm very glad for. Historically, Sweden had only an agreement with the US, but, as you know, the political administration of the US can change. Now in NATO we see the defense spending is going up for everyone. It is important that we are doing a lot in Europe to make sure that we invest in a strong defense. In the end, we are stronger together. In these times with Russia being so active, I think NATO membership for Sweden is important.

— If Russia were to attack Baltic states, should Sweden actively intervene and support its neighbors?

— Absolutely. And I would have said the same thing even if we were not a NATO member. It is very important for Swedes and all Europeans to understand that what Ukrainians are doing today is to try to protect Ukraine, but in a way, they are fighting for Europe. If we come to a situation where Putin would attack a Baltic state then Sweden is at war — that is the consequence. For us it would be unthinkable not to act. I think that goes for all the Nordic countries.

You can see since last year how strongly the Nordic countries have been supporting what Baltic states were saying for a long time. I wish that NATO and the European Union would have listened more to the Baltic states earlier. We should have acted earlier. When Russia annexed Crimea, we should have stopped Putin. Not acting earlier was a big mistake. Why did we not let Ukraine become a member of NATO? If that would have been the case then Russia would not have attacked Ukraine.

— Just over the course of a week, Russia has sent around 114 ballistic missiles, 1270 drones, and about 1100 heavy gliding bombs towards Ukraine. The majority of those go against the civilian population. How does it make you feel?

— It is horrible. When I think of all the lives that are lost — families who just wanted to live their ordinary life and have a future for themselves, for their children… These are atrocities — what Putin is doing.

I get very upset when I see some political leaders saying that this is a conflict about territory. In fact, this is an attack on Ukraine and the Ukrainian people. There is only one solution to this war: that Russia and Putin leave Ukraine — this is the only solution.

We should welcome every initiative to have a tribunal, because if we come to a solution where Ukraine has won the war, then that doesn't mean that we are done. We also need accountability for what has happened. Putin is not interested in anything else than power for himself, and the war is a way for him to stay in power in Russia, but he needs to face the consequences for what he has done and for all the lives that he has destroyed.

— Clearly, this war is not about territory. What are the reasons behind this war?

— It is a war about what kind of values and what kind of society you want to see in this region. Ukraine is interesting because Ukraine is European and preparing itself for European Union membership — which I am very much in favor of. The people of Ukraine want freedom. They want to live in a democracy. They want to have the opportunity to choose between political alternatives: if you're not happy with a political alternative, then you can vote for another one that might do a better job. And one day it will be their turn to leave power because you vote for something else. You want free and independent media. You want to have opportunities for yourself. All this is a threat to Putin, because what he's doing in Russia and what he wants to have in what he sees as his Russian sphere of influence is he doesn't want this to be a successful country, choosing this model. That is basically what this war is about.

It is also about to destabilize Europe and to cause a split — that has been, perhaps, the biggest failure. There have been two big failures on Putin's side in this war. First, that he thought he could easily beat the Ukrainians — and it is very clear that they are strong, and they are not giving up. Their resistance is admirable, fantastic. Second, he thought that Europe would be totally divided — and we have not been totally divided. Yes, we should have acted earlier, the support for Ukraine should have been more massive than it was, but in the end, we will not leave Ukraine alone. Europe has more money than the Russians do. The sanctions are starting to hurt the Russian economy. So, I think the future is positive. But it is very hard to deal with Russia, because for Putin it is very hard to find a way out of this.

— Conceivably, there is a pressure for Putin to carry on with his war, but for how long can he do that from the economic perspective, given the rate of loss of people and war expenses?

— It is very hard for me to assess how much time it might take. But this war is hurting the Russian economy. We are sometimes worried about the European patience with this war, and we tell the European citizens, "We have to be there for Ukraine, whatever it takes and for how long it takes," — but look at all the lives that also have been lost in Russia: young men just sent to death. For what? To kill neighbors Ukrainians? It's terrible in that way as well. I'm not in favor of President Trump's negotiating tactics with Putin, but I think we all want an end to the war — that is clear for everyone. But it cannot be a ceasefire with wrong conditions. It cannot be that we give in to Putin, because then we know it's just time for him to regroup. In a couple of years we will have a war again. We have tried that before from Europe's side: we have trusted Putin, but we cannot trust Putin. All my Baltic colleagues have said to me the same thing all the time since the day I was elected to this house in 2019, "You cannot trust Putin, and he will never stop." I think it is important for European leaders to understand that.

So, we need to come to something that would be a lasting peace.

— How does the future of Russia look like?

— For us it is not an option to go back to a same-as-before relationship with Russia. After this war Putin and many others need to face accountability in jail for what they have done. If the Russian people elect other leaders that are taking Russia on another path, that could potentially open up for a new relation with Russia. But as for Sweden, to be honest, I don't see us having a normal relationship with Russia for a very, very long time, because even if Putin went today, I'm not sure that I would be applauding whoever is coming directly after him.

— Where do you see the future Belarus on the geopolitical map?

— Belarus is in the heart of Europe. As we saw with the stolen election in 2020, there are clearly Belarusians who just want to live a normal life: a free life in Europe. That is what we must fight for. I see a lot of bravery in the Belarusian opposition, and we are doing whatever we can to support them. Thousands of people are in jail under horrible conditions. Lukashenka's regime has been going on for too long. He is in a way a puppet of Putin and he needs his support to stay in power, and perhaps when we come to a solution with Putin, it will be the same time for Lukashenko, who knows?

— Do you see future Belarus as a member of NATO?

— I think that would be the absolute best alternative because that is the guarantee that we need in the region. Many say that NATO membership provoked Putin to go into Ukraine — that is the Russian narrative. The same argument you hear about Belarus. But for us, it is not a hostile action to become a member of NATO. It just means that if you attack us, then yes, we will defend each other together. The most effective way to bring security to Ukraine and Belarus would be NATO membership. That's the most effective way to make sure that we have a safe future for everyone.